Have You Killed An Atheist Today?
“Posted For Christians Only, Not Intended For Others”
A while back I stumbled on an atheist blog on mySpace. He
put out a challenge for Christians to go seven days letting everyone they knew
think they had turned to atheism. This was to prove that atheists were being
persecuted more than any other people like theists. On starting the challenge
he took great pains to paint a picture of the suffering atheist that was being
persecuted for his belief or lack of. When I read this I could not believe that
he actually thought that more atheists have been killed than Christians through
the years. So I smugly commented back for him to give me at least one account
of an atheist being killed by a Christian.
Well his reply dropped my jaw. He gave me two, one on the comment page and one by email.
“Ashley John Appoo, 40, pleaded guilty in a court in Brisbane, Australia, to the manslaughter death of John Leslie McDonald, and to cause grievous bodily harm to McDonald’s wife, Alois, during an ax attack in November 2001. Appoo, a hitchhiker whom McDonald picked up and befriended, went berserk when Ms. McDonald mentioned they were atheists. Described as a “proud Christian whose bible was one of his most precious possessions,” Appoo grabbed an ax and began attacking the couple. Source: Daily Telegraph, Dec. 23, 2004″
And “On October 18, 2004, Arthur Shelton, a self-described Christian and Eagle Scout, murdered his friend and roommate, Larry Hooper, because Hooper didn’t believe in God.”
Well his reply dropped my jaw. He gave me two, one on the comment page and one by email.
“Ashley John Appoo, 40, pleaded guilty in a court in Brisbane, Australia, to the manslaughter death of John Leslie McDonald, and to cause grievous bodily harm to McDonald’s wife, Alois, during an ax attack in November 2001. Appoo, a hitchhiker whom McDonald picked up and befriended, went berserk when Ms. McDonald mentioned they were atheists. Described as a “proud Christian whose bible was one of his most precious possessions,” Appoo grabbed an ax and began attacking the couple. Source: Daily Telegraph, Dec. 23, 2004″
And “On October 18, 2004, Arthur Shelton, a self-described Christian and Eagle Scout, murdered his friend and roommate, Larry Hooper, because Hooper didn’t believe in God.”
This really chapped me. At first glance my response was
typical,” These were not real “Christians”. But on giving it more thought. This
argument is all used up. The person reporting on the Larry Hooper story, who
was an atheist, and reported on how the “Christians” treated him during the
trial, calling them devils and shoving their crosses in their faces like they
were vampires and just plain hateful.
And although these are atheist sources, I say it is a shame that I have no problem believing they are true.
So I want to address this post to Christians. Have you all ever read the Ten Commandments, “Thou (that means you) shalt (you will not) Kill (stop the life of an innocent being). What part don’t you understand? God has told no one to kill anyone in His name. You say you read and follow the Bible, well let’s take a look at that:
Matthew 5:43, you have heard that it was said, “love your neighbor and hate your enemies”. But I (Jesus) say to you, love your enemies. Pray for those who hurt you.
1 John 2:9, anyone who says,” I am in the light,” but hates a brother or sister (even under Adam), is still in darkness.
1 John 4:20, if people say, “I love God”, but hate their brothers or sisters they are liars. Those who do not love their brothers and sisters, whom they have seen, cannot love God, whom they have not seen. Get the picture? We are to love others, not kill them.
To kill a person whom God created is a serious sin against God. You will never have a good reason to do this. Although atheists have gathered us in mass and killed us like animals, so what?
They constantly insult us by telling us we are stupid and do not use our brains, so what?
You can’t even get on a Christian forum for encouragement without one butting in and insulting you, so what? You can’t watch a sit-com with your family without seeing a Christian depicted as a lunatic murderer, so what?
These would make a natural person want to attack back, but we are not to be natural.
We are not our own, we are bought with a price.
Jesus said, “If the world hates you, remember that it hated Me first. If you belonged to the world, it would love you as it loves its own. But I have chosen you out of the world, so you don’t belong to it. That is why the world hates you. Remember what I told you: A servant is not greater than his Master, If people did wrong to Me, they will do all this to you on account of Me, because they do not know the one who sent Me.” John 15:18-21
People, it would be better for us to die than an unbeliever.
The Bible says, “Say to them, as I live, says the Lord God, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that the wicked turn from his way and live. Turn back, turn back from your evil ways, for why will you die O house of Israel?” Ezekiel 33:11 King James
and “Precious in the sight of the LORD is the death of his saints.” Psalm 116:15
Years ago I used to travel a little for a small company and I decided I would take a gun just in case I needed it. The Lord impressed on me the question,” Would I really kill someone and send them to hell instead of yielding and risk him sending me to Heaven?” I held on to the gun for a while joking with the idea that I would never kill, but it was surprising what someone could live through. I later got rid of the gun. My point is we are not to kill, if anyone was to be killed we should have the attitude that it would be better if it was us. This would give the Lord full time to reveal Himself to the unbeliever.
Now let us return to the murdered atheists. Who the hell are we to kill someone just because they do not believe? This makes me mad and we have seen above how God feels. He has no pleasure. God does not smile. You have given Him no pleasure. These impostors will have to stand before the Lord and give account of them. And the worst of it all is that some of you are more offended over me saying “hell” than over these two men killed. Repent. Change your way of thinking. Turn to Jesus and love your neighbor as yourself. For believe me, if you hate your neighbor you are not saved no matter how many times you walk that aisle and shed a few tears.
An Atheist is not our enemy. Not gays. Not any unbelievers!
“Our fight is not against people on earth but against the rulers and authorities and the powers of this world’s darkness, against the spiritual powers of evil in the heavenly world.” Ephesians 6:12
Have we forgotten these things? Or did we ever know? If you’re one of those who pickets graves of dead soldiers, bash gays or anything else you believe is God’s will, you’d better read all the Bible. Without the love of Christ operating in you are no different than the ones you hate. You just know how to speak religious and you hinder the Holy Spirit moving on the unbelievers.
It is real simple: Treat others the way you want to be treated”. Even atheists, gays and unbelievers can do this. And then all the hate crimes will cease. And I leave you with this: “You have heard that it was said to our people long ago, ’you must not murder anyone. Anyone who murders anyone will be judged.’ But I (Jesus) tell you, if you are angry with a brother or sister, you will be judged.” Matthew 5:21-22
Note: This post is intended for Christians, please all else hold your negative comments. Verses are from the New Century Version
Originally Posted: Friday, March 07, 2008
And although these are atheist sources, I say it is a shame that I have no problem believing they are true.
So I want to address this post to Christians. Have you all ever read the Ten Commandments, “Thou (that means you) shalt (you will not) Kill (stop the life of an innocent being). What part don’t you understand? God has told no one to kill anyone in His name. You say you read and follow the Bible, well let’s take a look at that:
Matthew 5:43, you have heard that it was said, “love your neighbor and hate your enemies”. But I (Jesus) say to you, love your enemies. Pray for those who hurt you.
1 John 2:9, anyone who says,” I am in the light,” but hates a brother or sister (even under Adam), is still in darkness.
1 John 4:20, if people say, “I love God”, but hate their brothers or sisters they are liars. Those who do not love their brothers and sisters, whom they have seen, cannot love God, whom they have not seen. Get the picture? We are to love others, not kill them.
To kill a person whom God created is a serious sin against God. You will never have a good reason to do this. Although atheists have gathered us in mass and killed us like animals, so what?
They constantly insult us by telling us we are stupid and do not use our brains, so what?
You can’t even get on a Christian forum for encouragement without one butting in and insulting you, so what? You can’t watch a sit-com with your family without seeing a Christian depicted as a lunatic murderer, so what?
These would make a natural person want to attack back, but we are not to be natural.
We are not our own, we are bought with a price.
Jesus said, “If the world hates you, remember that it hated Me first. If you belonged to the world, it would love you as it loves its own. But I have chosen you out of the world, so you don’t belong to it. That is why the world hates you. Remember what I told you: A servant is not greater than his Master, If people did wrong to Me, they will do all this to you on account of Me, because they do not know the one who sent Me.” John 15:18-21
People, it would be better for us to die than an unbeliever.
The Bible says, “Say to them, as I live, says the Lord God, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that the wicked turn from his way and live. Turn back, turn back from your evil ways, for why will you die O house of Israel?” Ezekiel 33:11 King James
and “Precious in the sight of the LORD is the death of his saints.” Psalm 116:15
Years ago I used to travel a little for a small company and I decided I would take a gun just in case I needed it. The Lord impressed on me the question,” Would I really kill someone and send them to hell instead of yielding and risk him sending me to Heaven?” I held on to the gun for a while joking with the idea that I would never kill, but it was surprising what someone could live through. I later got rid of the gun. My point is we are not to kill, if anyone was to be killed we should have the attitude that it would be better if it was us. This would give the Lord full time to reveal Himself to the unbeliever.
Now let us return to the murdered atheists. Who the hell are we to kill someone just because they do not believe? This makes me mad and we have seen above how God feels. He has no pleasure. God does not smile. You have given Him no pleasure. These impostors will have to stand before the Lord and give account of them. And the worst of it all is that some of you are more offended over me saying “hell” than over these two men killed. Repent. Change your way of thinking. Turn to Jesus and love your neighbor as yourself. For believe me, if you hate your neighbor you are not saved no matter how many times you walk that aisle and shed a few tears.
An Atheist is not our enemy. Not gays. Not any unbelievers!
“Our fight is not against people on earth but against the rulers and authorities and the powers of this world’s darkness, against the spiritual powers of evil in the heavenly world.” Ephesians 6:12
Have we forgotten these things? Or did we ever know? If you’re one of those who pickets graves of dead soldiers, bash gays or anything else you believe is God’s will, you’d better read all the Bible. Without the love of Christ operating in you are no different than the ones you hate. You just know how to speak religious and you hinder the Holy Spirit moving on the unbelievers.
It is real simple: Treat others the way you want to be treated”. Even atheists, gays and unbelievers can do this. And then all the hate crimes will cease. And I leave you with this: “You have heard that it was said to our people long ago, ’you must not murder anyone. Anyone who murders anyone will be judged.’ But I (Jesus) tell you, if you are angry with a brother or sister, you will be judged.” Matthew 5:21-22
Note: This post is intended for Christians, please all else hold your negative comments. Verses are from the New Century Version
Originally Posted: Friday, March 07, 2008
13 comments:
I don't know if you'd consider this a negative comment or not. I don't call myself a Christian but I consider myself to be a strong Christian sympathizer, so I hope you give a fair hearing to my humble opinion.
I think you're being too hard on your fellow Christians. The two examples of Christians killing atheists were just that, two. I think I can safely say that there's never been mass murder of atheists by Christians, not even during the Dark or Middle Ages. On the other hand, when they've had total power over a land atheists have murdered millions, non-Christians as well as Christians, in order to create a godless utopia. Call me picky, but I don't think the murders of two atheists balances that out.
The truth of the matter is that atheists are NOT persecuted in America, Australia, or anywhere else in the Western world. On the contrary, they hold the reigns of power and use it to proselytize an anti-Christian world view to the culture. Maybe your atheist "friend" doesn't realize that because most unbelievers in power don't call themselves atheists, a word which has negative connotations. Instead, they usually call themselves humanists, secularists,or secular humanists. A few even try to pass themselves off as believers.
So I think you should cut your spiritual brothers and sisters some slack. Remember, Christians are to defend their faith, not engage in self-defeating and destructive self-criticism and self-loathing. Just my humble opinion.
Thank you very much for your comment. I agree with all that you said and even posted some of the same stuff on my blog at myspace. The fact of atheist killing a lot more christian than otherwise falls a lot of times on death ears. They seem exspect us to take responsiblity for the death of Mulims during the crusades but they are not willing to burden the responsiblity for Russia, China, or Cambodia.
Thanks again for the comment and please come back.
I think it's sad that the only comments on such a post are from people basically saying that
- it's only two so it's not that bad
- blame atheists for the actions of communists
There are clearly more than two situations in which a Christian has killed a non-Christian in recent years. For a start there was another in Australia where a Christian "accidentally" knifed someone after a minor debate about God.
And atheists can hardly be blamed for communism. Atheism is not an organisation, nor does it have any specific set of beliefs besides 'gods do not exist'. Nobody kills 'in the name of' atheism.
How about, rather than looking for religion or atheism to be the cause of violence, we look to the outside factors that are MUCH more likely to actually be the cause. Take Mr. Appoo for example, he was reported as "prone to outbursts of intense irrational anger due to an organic personality disorder caused when he was hit over the head with a didgeridoo in 1995" (by The Age, Dec. 23, 2004).
In any case where somebody does something outside of established legal and social norms, it isn't likely to be caused by some universal belief system, but rather by some sort of dysfunctionality within that individual.
It needs to be said that atheism isn't an organization in the same way Christianity and other religions are. When you say things like, "They (atheists) seem exspect us to take responsiblity for the death of Mulims during the crusades" you're generalizing a group of people that share very little in common with each other other than lack of belief in God.
I'm an atheist, and I don't expect Christians to take responsibility for the actions of their specific ancestors. The crusades, communist Russia, the holocaust, the reign of Pol Pot, these are tragic events in HUMAN history, not just atheist or theist history, and if anyone is to take responsibility for them we all should.
Also, Seane-Anna, you said...
"The truth of the matter is that atheists are NOT persecuted in America"
And:
"most unbelievers in power don't call themselves atheists, a word which has negative connotations."
So do you think atheists are persecuted against or not?
It is my opinion that every religion or belief, be it Christianity, Jewish, Wicca, Atheism or lifestyle
issues, has been persecuted against. And we can find examples of this thousands of times over throughout history. But none of these examples were caused by the fact that there is a God or not. They were brought about by men or women. What those people did in the name of God, or in the name of No God, Had nothing to actually do with Christ or the lack of him.
These people or governments wanted control over others. The Nazis called the Jewish people Christ-killers to insight hatred. The heart of Communism is no God so that there is no higher authority in people's lives than the government. The Crusades gave the Catholic church (ran by men, not God) a chance to steal from other countries, and radical Muslims believe they have the right kill any nonbelievers, be they Jewish, Christian, Atheist,or any different religion or lifestyle. These things do not come from God. They come from Men. God's words are "Thou shalt not kill" (actually, taken from the original Hebrew the commandment is 'thou shall not Murder') and Christ said "love your enemies". If people or governments twist the words of God or Allah to suit their own purposes that is the fault of the men or women doing the bad deeds and only those people.
We can go on blaming each other because of our belief or lack thereof forever, but I do hope there will come a time when we can get past the fact we all have differences and just accept each other.
Remember:
Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations.
Perhaps Christians don't realize what God has himself done to slaughter millions, and yes many who he thought deserved to be murdered--like anyone who was not of the correct faith.
Recall the well known song. I used to sing it well when I was younger but my voice went with age. It contains the line "Onward Christian Soldiers, marching as to war" Recall? it's a killing song. "His sharp sword" Remember now? The Bible and religion justified killing. Made it OK.
We forget about that in our chase for the good.
I'm a devout Catholic, but I have to admit, the atheists have something to say. and they make strong and reasonable points. They have me listening. They are not against God, they think that God is only a myth.
I listened well when a Professor of psychology lectured about the Christian and Catholic church practicing brainwashing to get parents to indoctrinate the kids at a young age, when they were more likely to not think and be frightened enough to follow well. When I think about that, I know I was brainwashed too. If I was born in the middle east instead of Texas, would I worship the Qur'an? I have to admit, I probably would. I would do as my parents said.
The Muslims are just as convinced that there is only one God as we are of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost. I just crossed myself after I typed that. I AM brainwashed. I can't consider both sides and make a real decision. I am afraid of anything not supporting my religion. I want to smash it.
I want to be religious, but not under the fears of it, but for the blessings of it, and I can't, because I live in fear. All of us do. We can't look at anything or investigate for ourselves because we were brainwashed as very young children when we learned to say out prayers. I'm through buying a myth for at least a year.
Then I will know.
No one knows the state of mind Mr. Shelton was in when he did what he did. I have know him since we were 2 or 3 years old. He was always a good friend to me. He worked on my car when I needed it fixed, he even tried to help me when I had problems with my teens. He was raised in a Lutheran School and they do teach Christian beliefs there. I had discussions with him about God more than once. The stress in his life caused him a great deal of emotional struggles. He is in prison and I am sure he is on medication to stabilize his thoughts and his mind. Yes he was wrong for what he did. I have no excuses to offer you for his behavior. I do know that he told me that the man he shot was planning on shooting 3 people so if he killed one man to save 3 lives he thinks he did the right thing. Only God will be his judge and if he asked for God's forgiveness I am sure he is forgiven. The Atheists who showed up in court were just looking to start more trouble for Christianity. None of them even knew the man whose life was taken, Mr Hooper, so why did they even need to be there? Oh well. I know that God loves us all and he did send his son to die for us so that we might be free from our sins and forgiven.
No I haven't killed an atheist today yet but it's on my to-do list...
You will never know true peace and happiness until you let go of the mind crippling religious beliefs your parents introduced to you as a child. They meant no harm and were only forcing you to go to church out of love and fear. Respect their intent but understand that your instinctive ability to logically process information has been severely manipulated. Try to find new and better answers to questions you asked as a child but were never given satisfactory answers by your parents or members of the church. You were right to doubt them but you somehow stopped questioning and started believing. And I beg of you all to please not kill me because of my non belief. I just prefer having evidence over having blind faith.... not really something you should ever want to kill someone over.
Dear Anonymous, I did go against my parents as a teen, the drugs and the whole thing. It was only through believing in Christ as a real person and trusting in Him that I was delivered from that death. You do not know anything about me or others who trust in Him. Why do you judge us, if we say anything about atheist, we are acussed of being haters. It also seems you did not read all of the post because you foolishly ask us not to kill you. You missed the point. If you took the study of your beliefs as sloppy as you read this article and then judged us. I do not want anything you have to offer in place of my love for Christ. So please don't be offended when I ask you to go spread your haterd somewhere else or show me something better, and it had better be good.
“Thou (that means you) shalt (you will not) Kill (stop the life of an innocent being).
Where does the word "innocent" appear from here?
This implies that you feel that in some cases it is appropriate to kill a human being.
What are these appropriate cases?
Incidentally, the communist regimes replaced one religion with another - the state, the primacy of the party, and the cult-of-personality of the leadership. All the traits of religion are there.
The Nazi regime was primarily Christian - Adolf himself said so. The belt of the Wehrmacht soldier said "Gott Mit Uns" on it - "God with us". The Nazis suppressed all atheist and freethought movements.
It is the tendency to unquestioning acceptance of authority that is our undoing - whether religious or not. This is what leads us to invest far too much power in our political leaders, (or indeed any power at all to religious leaders). It is this that results in people being murdered by the state.
It isn't just Christians that persecute atheists. All religions persecute those who are considered to be outsiders - look at the horrendous case of Amina bint Abdul Halim bin Salem. On the 12th of December, it will be one year since she was executed for the imaginary crime of witchcraft and sorcery. Beheaded - in public.
This is the reason for secular politics. It protects people like Amina bint Abdul Halim bin Salem from lunatics, their thought-crimes, and their sharp blades.
The innocent are those that are killed on purpose for not reason. The book of Proverbs has something to say about a person who "lays in wait to shed innocent blood to take their goods". The life of the murder is precesous also to God but He is just and the murder forfits his life when he breaks this law. God hates all death, that is why he came and gave His life to end death.
Also the nazis where not Christians. This is a lie of the libral media. Hitler took over the German Church (the Church in Germany was the State Church and all pastors where paid from the State) The soilders were not Christians just because they wore God on their belt buckles no more than everyone who puts a little fish on the trunk of their car is one. This is sort of nieve. I recommend the book, Bonhoeffer: Pastor, Martyr, Prophet, Spy by Eric Metaxas for a more better history of the time from someone who died for his beleifs in Nazi Germany.
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